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Connie and I had four children between July 1970 and September 1975. That was a fun decade especially given I was going to school three nights a week until 1978 when after nine years I received a degree.
Those fun times were only surpassed by the ten years when we had one, two or three children in college at once. Our oldest went to Carnegie Mellon on a required five-year program and the others all went to Franklin and Marshall – yeah, that Franklin.
To be honest I don’t know how we managed financially and all the numbers are a bit fuzzy after our youngest graduated in 1998. To complicate matters with a display of financial foolishness, we bought our Cape Cod house in 1987. Truth be told we could only do that because we rented it most of the summer and it operated as a business for ten years lowering our tax bill. I still wouldn’t recommend that strategy though.
Regular HD readers may recall my big purchases – my car and our vacation home – were very much emotionally driven. I guess you could say that about paying for college too. Connie and I never had the chance of going to proper college, but we were determined our children would. No column on a spreadsheet covers that kind of spending😎
When our youngest graduated in1998 the yearly cost at F&M was around $26.000. The first year total cost at Carnegie Mellon in 1988 was about $18,000. Today both are around $80,000. The CPI index says the $18,000 should be $47,897.95. Something is amiss me thinks.
Our oldest grandson just started at Gettysburg College and that too has a annual sticker price of about $80,000, but he received a good aid package.
We are going to help our grandchildren in college as much as possible. Given the youngest is only nine, some of that help may be posthumously.
If you asked me to detail how we paid collage costs for four children, I couldn’t do it. I do know what aid they received was minimal. Two received jobs on campus as part of aid package.
I do recall we cashed in two small mutual funds. I lowered my 401k to just the match level. At one point I took a 401k loan – not a great idea. Our first major debt was a HELOC, but it had a variable interest rate and after year or so writing checks, the interest rate started to rise. I panicked.
We then remortgaged our home taking as much equity as possible. That meant we were still paying college costs years after the youngest graduated.
All this was supplemented by simply paying what we needed from my income.
I still feel stress recalling writing checks for those monthly payment books. I started a small – very small – side business from home to help with those checks. All our children had campus and summer jobs to pay for their books and personal expenses.
Full disclosure here. In retrospect we would not have the lifestyle we have today in retirement without my pension. We have substantial investments, but they could never generate an income equal to my pension. The thing is, when using all our assets at the time, borrowing to the hilt and living paycheck to paycheck for ten years, the possible future impact on our lives never crossed my mind.
I was age 45 when our oldest entered college. That son is now 54 with three children, the oldest 13 and twins 11. Our other children are in similar situation. Our second son is 53 with children ages 14, 12 and 9. I’m pretty sure with no pensions, retirement in their 50s maybe even 60s is not in the cards.
Was it all worth it? For us it was because it was something we had to do and wanted to do, but from a practical perspective for the person accumulating years of debt, I have my doubts.
Our daughter used her teaching degrees for a few years, our oldest son used his civil engineering degrees for a few years, the other two sons work far afield from their degrees.
When it comes to college, paying for it and assessing the value, society has a long way to go separating the wheat from the chaff in my opinion.
I went to San Diego State University in the seventies and tuition was about $100 / semester. And, I used my accounting degree for a wonderful career. It was a great opportunity for citizens which has generally eroded over time.
Mr. Quinn you did right by your kids! Well done!
Interesting stories. I wanted to mention a couple of things about our kids that might help some folks that read HD with high school/college age kids. First of all, our daughter who has a CPA, was able to be in a special program at our state university for a masters in Accounting. She had 2 internships and worked a part time job at the university under a CPA. Because of these, she had enough experience under her belt that she could sit for all the CPA exams in the summer after she graduated and passed the last one right when she turned 23 and started her job. We had no idea the 2 internships and part time job would add up to the experience she needed to sit for the exams. So, she didn’t need to work and study for the exams like so many of her coworkers. Chris
The second thing I wanted to mention was our son. He learned that the USDA has fellowship opportunities for Agriculture students. They are for majors that don’t have very many masters and PhDs. Our son was a food science major, and it qualified. Our government is trying to educate the next generation of research scientists and college professors in these fields. He received tuition, a living stipend, and funds for his research. He came out of school debt free with a PhD and is working in his field as a research scientist. Our family is very grateful for the fellowships he got. Chris
Similar to Dick, I got my BS in Accounting going to school at night and working full time with wife and 2 young children. It took me 6 years to complete 4 years of college because earlier college courses did not transfer. My company paid the tuition which was at a state school, UNC Charlotte.
Our son, the oldest, went to community college for a couple of semesters but got into home construction and never finished. He is still at it, running his own remodeling business at age 56. He loves doing what he does but does not make a lot of money.
I told our daughter we would pay her tuition to a state school. She wanted to go to UNC Chapel Hill, but was late with her application, and wound up at UNC Charlotte. I did pay as you go with her and she graduated in 4 years with a degree in finance. I gave her an allowance but she also worked part time. Charlotte is a big banking town, so that is a great degree here. She held off getting married until after graduation. She got married that summer and I paid for the wedding out of pocket. I had also bought her a new car with the deal that she would assume payments once she got a job.
She moved to Charleston soon after marriage. She worked for a few years and then became a SAHM. She has a special needs daughter, which prevents her from going back to work after her other 2 daughters finished school.
Her oldest daughter went to Auburn and paid out of state tuition the first 2 years. She graduated in 3.5 years with a degree in fashion design which is similar to history in terms of job prospects. She has her dream job managing a boutique wedding dress business, and makes about $50k a year in Charleston. She could do a lot better financially, but loves her work. Her younger sister is a junior at South Carolina. My daughter refused to pay out of state tuition again. We have helped with tuition with both girls but her husband has a six figure job with CSX, so they are in good shape financially.
Like others, I think our college system is broken. I served on 2 advisory councils at our local state university and saw first hand some of the issues. Many kids get degrees and rack up college debt and find their job opportunities are meager. There is tremendous demand for people in the trades which often requires no college at all and they can make more than those with 4 years degrees in the arts. They also probably have much higher job satisfaction.
We told our children born in 85 and 88 that we would pay 1/2 the cost of their education (we thought they should have some skin in the game), up to 40K. In ‘98 during the Russian debt crisis (when interest rate in US plummeted) we refinanced our house from a 30 to a 15 year loan and took out 80K in equity. We cut about 5 years off the loan and our mortgage payments went up only $100/month, and back then interest was deductible on your taxes.
We put the money into CDs, changing to 6 month CDs when our first went to college in ‘04. We put her tuition payments on our credit card in order to get the points.The CDs matured the month after the tuition was due, we would take out the correct amount and then return the balance to another 6 months.
Since our daughter was an excellent student we front loaded her 40K her first year. We knew she would complete her degree and this would save her some interest. She graduated and is utilizing her degree.
Our son, the youngest, did not show much interest in high school. After graduation he went to the local technical college for three semesters with a general education major (back then they first allowed your child to stay on your health insurance if they were in college). We didn’t start assisting with his expenses until after the first semester when he showed he was willing to put in the work. To our chagrin with one semester to an associates degree. He eventually completed his degree after a few years of working minimum wage jobs.
When his girlfriend decided to go to PA school in Delaware he decided to complete a degree in history and was dean’s list each semester. At this point the balance of our college money for him was spent on a sorely needed kitchen renovation after he left community college. He has since worked as a barista, and now as an assistant tax collector. As many know you can’t do much with a bachelor’s degree in history, but it did help him become a critical thinker, and express himself.
The high school student who rarely cracked a book is now an avid reader of very esoteric books. So his degree didn’t help in his chosen profession, but it did help him to very much become an intellectual.😆
Dick, I wrote an article that shares a title with this post. In it, I discuss the pondering my family went through in making degree choices. In terms of cost, families have options on how much to pay for education. It doesn’t have to be the financial burden you describe.
Here’s Ed’s article:
https://humbledollar.com/2023/03/college-conundrum/
My kids went to local state institutions with cheap tuition. For example, my daughter got her accredited associates RN at the local community college about 25 years ago. It cost about $3K a year (tuition and books). Then while working full-time she went back to school part time and got her bachelor’s and masters degrees. Her accredited graduate nursing degree at the local university was about 15 years ago. Grand total cost of the graduate degree was about $30K. Since her current job pays a base salary of $165K and absolutely requires her graduate degree in nursing, I’d say the $30K for her graduate degree was an outstanding value. Meanwhile, another extended family member (arguably the best student of these 2) got a graduate degree at an expensive “name” school out of town. She majored in anthropology. Today she makes a living in an accounting job that doesn’t require a masters degree and is completely unrelated to anthropology. Value returned for that degree; minimal. When it comes to college in America, I think the value received (at least in terms of cost versus income) very much depends on the choices we make when choosing both the school and the degree.
That’s quite a story. Very different from the situation in Europe where tertiary education is generally free, provided a university will admit you. It’s no longer free in the UK, but costs are nothing like those you quote. Back in the 60s my bachelors degree cost my father 300 GBP as my living allowance was means tested and he made up the difference.
Have never heard of Franklin and Marshall – what do you mean by “that Marshall”? [Edit: meant to say “that Franklin”. Wasn’t that Franklin rather a long time ago?]
He means “Benjamin Franklin.”
A major reason the costs cited here are so high is that all three schools mentioned are private institutions.
I suppose Oxford and Cambridge might count as private, but their tuition is set at the government cap of roughly 9,000 GBP. Cambridge has a breakdown of living costs, looks like an undergraduate degree would run about 20,000 GBP a year all in, or $26,000. Most bachelor’s degrees take three years.
My daughters both graduated from catholic universities, both teachers, both are now full times moms, both had some modest student loan debt. I would say it was worth it. One example was how they dealt with their kids being out of school during the pandemic. Thanks to their teaching chops, my grandkids education didn’t miss a beat. I will add that we were fortunate that our daughter’s high school resumes brought in substantial scholarship money.
I’m also thinking back to my days as a beer truck driver. A few of my coworkers had bachelor degrees. Were those degrees being wasted? They were obviously not necessary for the job, but I would argue that those guys tended to be more analytical than average.
And college doesn’t have to break the bank. I am also a fan of kids staying at home, using community college before transferring to a university to achieve advanced degrees.
Dan – The decision for community college also depends on the ultimate degree. Local community colleges may not be able to provide the in-depth calculus, physics, and chemistry baselines required to advance to an engineering (or related science) degree.
Westchester CC, which is in the NY county where we live, has two year programs specifically designed to allow “seamless transfer opportunities” to four year colleges in a large number of professional fields including: pre-med, pre-law, civil-, mechanical-, electrical-, and general engineering, nursing, accounting and finance. AA degree graduates are guaranteed admission to a SUNY four-year college with credit for meeting the general education course requirements.
My family has had great experiences over two generations with NY’s SUNY and CUNY (City University of NY) systems. Though my husband and I both got four year degrees at Binghamton (tuition 100% covered by our Regents scholarships), for me, the greatest value in terms of job satisfaction and earnings, was from later in life nursing degrees: AAS from Queensborough Community College, followed by a BSN from Hunter College (both part of CUNY system). Doug’s most valuable degree was a Master’s in Operations Research from CUNY’s Bernard Baruch College.
yes, understood. And I also understand some credits may not transfer, so some research is necessary before taking that path.