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I recently encouraged a couple to see a financial advisor because the couple could not agree on family finance issues and one spouse would not even discuss the matter. She (in this case, but not gender unique) just wanted to spend and ignore the matters of future retirement and college costs or how income from one spouse was generated for the family.
I thought an independent third party could evaluate their finances and then explain the situation and make recommendations to the couple in an unemotional way.
Connie and I never had issues over money although she has little, if any, interest in investment matters which I wish was not the case. But when it comes to saving and spending we are and always have been in agreement- except on occasion discussing if it is better to buy on Amazon or go to the store. She occasionally agonizes over the relative cost per ounce of something. I’m saying “just put it in the cart.” The Amazon cart, not “those” carts.
I read about couples where one person just spends and the other saves or more likely stresses over the spending. One party worries about credit card debt and the other just uses the card.
I see financial compatibility as critical, but apparently not always easy. How can you know before marriage that it exists or can exist. I’m thinking that each party looking at the family situation of the other may provide a clue. That is the case in my example.
Unfortunately, love does not always conquer all especially when it comes to needs, wants, desires, the perception of necessity and money or the lack thereof….or budgeting 😎
My wife and are fairly well synchronized when it comes to spending habits, but she has no interest whatsoever in financial topics. My parents were “Silent Generation”-types, who lived on the installment debt treadmill and had practically no savings habits, while hers were slightly older, having endured the Great Depression as children, and were maniacal savers and nearly pathologically frugal. So, we’ve both reacted against our respective upbringings. She tends to spend more freely than I do, but we manage to make things work out. I can’t think of a single blow-out fight over money in our nearly 40 years of marriage, and we’re on track for a comfortable retirement in a couple more years. Thanks be to God!
Interesting topic. My daughter recently got married and is the primary breadwinner as her new husband is starting Physician Assistant school at Duke. During the bridal shower they played the newlywed game and it was quite enlightening when the question of “who spends more” was raised, they both pointed to each other but eventually it was agreed that my daughter spent more.However, upon further discussion what emerged was that she was likely to spend on small things regularly and often household items whereas his spending was not as often but much larger dollar amounts and usually unrelated to the home.
For Christmas we gifted our daughter and our brand new son-in-law a very practical and strategic gift-$3000 towards a fee only financial planner. The purpose of the gift was so that they could work on their financial goals, desires, and habits together and make money something they could easily talk about rather than it coming up when it became an issue. We did not want to interfere or have them perceive us as interfering so we wrote them a nice letter explaining the goal of the gift and that we would always be there to support and answer questions but wanted them to have a professional that was guiding them around money matters. We gave them the hello nectarine site where they could pick from any planner they wanted and I had also culled through and given them 6 planners that I thought might work well for them. They were pleased although in private they said, “my wise decision about money would to not spend $3000 on a financial planner”😉
What was a bit frustrating and eye-opening was the response I got when I originally posted on a Retirement Facebook Page asking for recommendations of fee only planners. The recommendations were few but the questioning of my parenting was plenty! I had posted anonymously and soon took it down as it was causing me quite a bit of frustration and making me second-guess myself, our relationship and my intentions! Luckily it was met with gratitude from the recipients, and our hope is that as they continue to make more money they will have a better understanding of how to manage it and ultimately amass wealth.
I think the idea of funding financial planning as a gift is a wonderful idea. Nicely done.
Thanks Greg, we will see how it goes. I am very wary of AUM advisors and neither one of them is overly interested in finances yet I know when we pass away, there will be a substantial sum that they will need to know how to manage. It was easy for us because neither of us had much to begin with when we got married and we were both savers:)
When Cathy and I made the decision to get married, I asked her about her finances. She had a small car loan, a small consumer loan, a little bit of credit card debt and no savings. I told her I didn’t live that way… After we got married, I paid off her loans and opened up an IRA for her. IT’s been smooth as glass very since. I think she is a bigger penny pincher than I am. 🙂
My wife and I will celebrate our tenth anniversary on Valentines Day. We came from different economic backgrounds as far as retirement preparation. I have a pension, social security and a moderate IRA. She has social security and save like crazy in her IRA and Roth.
I was already retired when we met. We were able for her to retire early and delay Social Security until age 70. She is more comfortable with a financial advisor. So, I joined her in using the advisor. I know fees subtract from total return. Then again, we both sleep very well.
We pretty much spend as we want or need something. We still put money aside in a money market and an SMA. We both love to shop Amazon
We are now living in a CCRc, which has introduced monthly fees after living mortgage free for several years. However, things a flowing nicely
I would say we are in sync.
My wife Cindy and I were just reflecting recently on how we ended up in a comfortable financial position. Fortunately we both are pretty well aligned with our financial behaviours, so have had very little disagreement along the way.
Over time we have both gravitated towards what works for us – Cindy looks after the day to day financial matters, and I tend to spend more time and energy on our investments, as well as our business finances. This has worked out really well for us.
One thing that I appreciate is that Cindy has loosened up our spending as our financial situation has strengthened. I think old habits would have still had me being tight-fisted, but as I see Cindy spend a bit more, I recognise that she is 100% correct, and pointing us in the right direction.
Dick, I could so relate to what you wrote. While Spouse and I were raised in post WW2 middle class households and had similar upbringings, I was the one totally in charge of our finances, which was scary. Spouse had little interest and I was ignorant. Luckily we were both pretty frugal and debt averse, so things never got really awful, but I came close a few times. We were able to manage, but didn’t really have financial traction until I became more educated and we moved to a lower cost of living area in 1996. Fast forward to today and Spouse is finally involved, which I am so glad. Chris
I can say I am in charge of investing but not our finances in total. Nor do I want to be. All spending is 50/50 decisions, but in truth I usually give in to 60/40.
My wife and I don’t spend even $100 without consulting each other. This probably came from not having much discretionary money while raising our children. We continue this pattern even today with decades of inflation. I guess old people, with old habits die hard.
Same here.
Anything under $10 is OK.
Supposedly financial matters are the #3 cause of divorce. Lack of communication is #1 which may be related.
Money stress is a major strain on relationships.
Common issues include:
– Different spending habits
– Debt
– Unemployment
– Disagreements over priorities
Some people have a very different concept of money. At the core, I view money as a tool. As is true of all tools, they must be cared for and if they are, they will provide value for a very long period of time.
Others may view money as something to be used (spent) as soon as possible. I was once in a relationship with someone like that. Unsurprisingly there was never enough money, and even college savings were not sacred.
G and I have different approaches, but at our core we tend to be frugal and cautious investors. I’m the more adventurous but G has adapted and has her own retirement accounts. She has gradually moved her investing style closer to my approach.
We have similar views about debt. We prefer to be debt free, but are willing to use it strategically.
I think of our approach to finances as being ambidextrous. In many respects we are equally capable.
Perhaps the most difficult times were early in the relationship when we were working to understand our different approaches to spending and saving. But we aligned in certain important ways. For one, we agreed on a smaller, less costly apartment because we wanted to save for a house. We also agreed to set aside a percentage of income for retirement. On the other hand, we took a flexible stance. Once certain goals were met, we adjusted and expanded, to include true vacations, an RV and more flexibility for eating out.
I have been known to crunch numbers for hours, on occasion. My spouse avoids this. As I see it, she has other skills and I prefer that she applies herself in those areas.
We both run utilities, parental care, travel, meals etc. through a series of cash-back credit cards. She categorizes her cards each month. I pay the bills and run the numbers. She is fully aware of expenditures and cash flow. She can do this if necessary. But it is usually something I’m more willing to do and it frees her up.
All finances are on two laptops with backups. One is hers, and the other is mine. Files are synchronized periodically.
To your first point, in probably 75% of my married tax clients, only one person was engaged in the process. As to the sex of the person engaged, the break was probably near 50%.
Now I’m trying to recall if couples who were both engaged accumulated more savings. I don’t know, so I asked AI, and the short answer is, yes they do.
Choosing a partner. It almost seems transactional to look at a person’s family for an indication of compatibility, still, it’s good to ask those questions. And it’s about more than money. For example, is this the person I want to be the father/mother of my children? The following is from my first HD article:
After my first marriage ended I became analytical about the type of person I’d want as a romantic partner in the future. She would be an intelligent and independent woman who didn’t need a man to survive, and someone who shared my philosophy regarding saving and spending.
I had listed a few other items as well, but Jonathan edited them out of the article😁. I met Chrissy three years after my divorce, and like Mark and Suzie, there are some differences in our habits, but we’re close enough for rock and roll.
Regarding your last sentence in paragraph three, Chrissy had to ask me why I was laughing out loud.
I got a chuckle, too, and I think Humble Dollar contributors should have carte blanche to add humor to their articles.
Love your pun intended. I always appreciate a chuckle, and occasionally a laugh out loud first thing in the morning.
And if you’re the Brian White from Upstate NY, yes, I’m your friend’s mom, though I think you’re probably not that Brian White.
I’d say my wife Suzie and I are compatible but slightly out of phase financially. Suzie has always been an exceptional saver—still is. I was never much of a saver myself, but I’ve always been a firm believer in investing as much as possible in the markets.
Our spending patterns differ too. I’m tight-fisted with day-to-day purchases but have no problem blowing the budget on a high-end bike or top-quality tennis racket when I decide I need one. Suzie takes a steadier approach, consistently buying reasonably priced items throughout the year. I’m sure it all balances out between us in the end.
This is complicated. Who comes to a relationship from a background of privilege or poverty? Who is earning money or is reliant on their partner financially? Who has student / mortgage debt before or during the relationship? These issues are as divisive for couples as politics, religion, and other compatibility questions.
Yes they are. Connie and I had very little differences in our backgrounds. Both parents had very little. Both lived only on SS. And we started with no assets and modest incomes.