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CAN IT REALLY BE TWO years since I wrote about sending my twins off to college? One is a chemistry major, midway through her junior year. Meanwhile, for her twin sister, the artist, there have been big changes in her college trajectory.
My initial criteria for college selections included published statistics on cost, likelihood of admission, timely graduation and low rates of loan default. I took this last stat as a reasonable proxy for post-college success.
My daughter the chemistry major is on track to graduate after four years. This past semester was her first as an organic chemistry lab assistant. She’s applying for internships in her field. If that doesn’t work out, she’ll take any other job.
Her sister, after three semesters in art school, came home without a degree. She’d become uncomfortable with the expense, not to mention the raw talent, Herculean effort and plain old good luck that would be essential to earning a living in the arts. She loved the big city and befriended amazing people. I’d paid tuition in full each semester, so she walked away debt-free.
I’ve told her from the first to avoid the sunk cost fallacy—seeing something to completion only because she’d already invested considerable effort. Rather, I encouraged her to treat each semester as a new decision. She could continue at art school, look for work, switch to community college, become a volunteer or try something else.
She returned home with “some college,” a category frequently found in job descriptions. A family friend suggested she volunteer at a school library. In our city, many elementary school libraries are open part of the day and staffed by volunteers.
To take on this role at a public school required fingerprinting for a criminal background check and screening for tuberculosis. The principal explained the library was open four days a week, and she could volunteer as little or as much as she liked.
My daughter showed up like clockwork, from 9 a.m. to 3 p.m., three days a week. The principal occasionally reminded her that she didn’t have to be there every day, but she just kept coming on time each day, each week. She dressed stylishly and professionally.
Working in a children’s library played to her love of books and her creative, artistic nature, as well as her organizational skills. She found out she got along well with school-age children. She researched educational requirements for professional librarians. Our local community college has a certificate in library science, a reasonable starting point, so she enrolled.
She’d started in the company of a 76-year-old library volunteer. When the older woman told the principal she’d be leaving at the end of the school year, the principal decided their school needed a library whose opening wasn’t dependent on volunteers. She submitted paperwork to use some of her limited discretionary money to create a paid five-days-a-week, three-hours-a-day library position. She encouraged my daughter to apply.
This part-time job pays marginally more than minimum wage. Still, the application was an arduous, multi-week task that included a second fingerprinting and criminal background check, another tuberculosis test, plus three letters of reference and a panel interview.
My daughter spent the last week of the school year asking teachers she knew from her library work to write letters of recommendation. One noted that if she were hired, she’d be at school for half of each day. Why not apply for a second part-time job, as a classroom aide, for the other half? There was an open position for that, too.
My daughter decided to apply for the aide position. This involved a second application form, a physical strength test and a second panel interview. With two job applications in play, it seemed likely she’d get at least one offer.
She was offered both positions. Part-time plus part-time meant a fulltime job with regular hours at a single site. The aide work has been hard, with on-the-job training and a steep learning curve, but she’s kept at it and it’s gotten easier.
She doesn’t yet earn enough to afford rent for her own apartment. I imagine she’ll eventually make more money, find roommates and move out. Meanwhile, she’s living at home, saving the bulk of her pay each month.
As a fulltime-equivalent employee, she qualifies for benefits. She gets sick pay, vacation days, and insurance for health, dental and vision. She’s also a member of the state teachers’ retirement system. If she works in this school or any public school in the state for five years, she can draw a pension someday. Even if she quits tomorrow, the money that the district has deposited into her retirement account has begun to compound, and she can leave it to grow for decades.
She’s also learned how to get hired. She attends meetings and trainings, opening paths for new friendships and jobs in related agencies. She imagines working at the same school for several years, while she earns a library science certificate and possibly, from there, transfer to our local state university to complete a bachelor’s degree in library science or education.
She faces no opportunity costs to attending college because she can take most classes at times that don’t interfere with her job. Her education trajectory is extremely cost-effective for me, too.
Maybe she’ll pivot to something else, but that doesn’t worry me. She’s got great mentors in her principal and the classroom teacher for whom she works as an aide. She gets plenty of on-the-job learning opportunities.
She talks with the young adults at school about where they live, how they found roommates and how they balance work with school. She’s earning and managing her own money. She still paints and draws, but as a hobby, not a vocation.
Meanwhile, her chemistry major sister is doing a lot of studying and considering graduate school. She’s hoping for a lab position somewhere when she completes her bachelor’s degree. She’s watching her sister manage fulltime work while going to school part-time. I can see her thinking through how she might do the same.
This leaves their brother, who is the new focal point of my worries. It’s his last year of high school, but he faces considerable credit deficits, having had little success with remote learning during the pandemic school closures. Summer school and credit recovery are one option.
He’s come up with something of a plan. When he turns 18, he’ll move closer to extended family in another state, where he’ll either finish high school or get a GED and a job, and then attend community college. He’s young, so his plans might change. I’m glad I’m not navigating the college application process with him this year, especially with the newly designed FAFSA form. I’m not sure where he’ll land, but I’ll provide financial support if it turns out he wants and needs it, just as I’ve assisted his sisters.
Here are five takeaways from my experiences so far:
Catherine Horiuchi is retired from the University of San Francisco’s School of Management, where she was an associate professor teaching graduate courses in public policy, public finance and government technology. Check out Catherine’s earlier articles.
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Our middle son always struggled in school, barely graduating HS after going to 4 different schools in 4 years, the last one being a boarding school that cost us $40,000. It was money well spent because, although he hated it, it got him over the line and he graduated. But then after briefly trying college, he ended up working a series of entry level jobs, never staying long enough to advance. After some serious health setbacks (open heart surgery at age 24) and watching both his brothers get Masters Degrees, he finally developed the motivation and maturity to go back to school. After some remedial college courses he was accepted into an accelerated RN program at a community college where he thrived, graduating at the top of his class. Today is this ” late bloomers” 32nd birthday. He is now working as a dialysis nurse with thoughts of becoming a Physicians Assistant.
Everybody’s path is different, some more circuitous than others, although Greg’s path definitely gave his mother and me a few extra gray hairs!😉
Thank you for your comment!
I was checking for something unrelated to this in a classic book on urban planning today, “A Pattern Language”. And was surprised to find a specific entry labeled Teen-age Society. It states plainly, “Teenage is the time of passage between childhood and adulthood. In traditional societies, this passage is accompanied by rites which suit the psychological demands of the transition. But in modern society the ‘high school’ fails entirely to provide this passage.”
Money well spent indeed, because we want our children to make the transition with the credentials to open more doors to their future. I appreciate you taking the time to tell the story of your late bloomer, and his important contribution today to the well-being of his patients, along with his continuing interest in self-improvement. This encourages me in my support of my youngest. I too have those extra gray hairs, badges of honor.
My parents paid the cost of two semesters for my youngest brother to attend college mostly to fish and “socialize”. He dropped out and found a job as a short order cook at a pub. He realized he loved cooking, graduated from the Culinary Institute of America, and enjoyed a long career as an Executive Chef at a very successful restaurant.
I learned from this situation when I became a father myself.
My son earned poor grades in high school, not because he was dumb, but because he wasn’t willing to “play the game” as his sister called it. After graduating he spent several years working at a candle factory. Eventually he attended community college to earn a degree is General Studies. During this time he attended a history class and the professor stimulated an interest in the subject. He eventually attended a four year college earning Dean’s list each semester and with minimal debt because of attending community college.
Thanks for commenting!
We might think “you can’t get there (long and satisfying career) from here (short order cook after dropping out)”. That would be an error. Your stories remind me of one friend whose son worked part-time in a record store during college and after college just kept working in the record store, not making any concerted effort to find a job requiring a college diploma. That’s all I knew before the two of us drifted apart. Fast forward a quarter of a century. He’s spent his entire career in the music industry, is an executive in a record company and has written feature articles for the Rolling Stone and New York Times on such amazing things as Nirvana’s first (unannounced) concert in Seattle. I credit my friend (and her son) for single minded support toward his goals, such as they were, making opportunities and taking opportunities. Or as Dan says below, “Keep moving forward until you get where you want to be.”
I’m glad to see you back, Catherine. I’ve missed your writing and wondered how you were doing. Thanks for the update on your kids.
I react to your story both as a parent and as a professor. I especially resonate with the point about “18-24 is not the only range of time to figure this out.” My previous academic job was at a California State University campus where many of the undergrads were transfer students from local community colleges and in their late 20s or into their 30s. They hadn’t been ready at 18 or 20 or 22, but they were now, and they were great, mature, motivated students who knew why they were there. This experience has helped me process how things have gone with my own younger daughter, who is about to turn 30 and has “some college” but not a degree yet.
I’d say, from your story that the keys to being able to find different paths as your three kids are doing include parental support (for example, your daughter can do what she’s doing at the school/library because she can live at home for now), avoiding student debt, and avoiding having kids of their own until they’re more settled. Debt limits your options, and so does having kids. I don’t mean that in a negative way—I loved raising my kids—but from a financial perspective, it definitely draws different parameters.
Thanks! Glad to be writing here again.
I have some years of experience in reviewing applications for graduate programs. There seem to be fewer and fewer applicants in their early twenties. I have processed many where a person has taken ten years or longer to earn their “four year” undergraduate degrees. Nationwide, the reporting on graduation rates is a “six year” number. Lots of reasons for this.
I enjoy reading your columns and comments as well!
Catherine, I enjoyed your article and you are to be commended for appreciating how each of your kids is unique and will achieve success in their own way. This is very hard for some parents as they instead try to enforce a certain uniformity on their kids, who may have very different aptitudes and interests.
Thank you for commenting. I have friends and neighbors who seem able to create that uniform product, though often there’s one kid who simply won’t get with the program.That hasn’t happened in my household, where there’s major variation in talent, apparent opportunities and motivation. I’m grateful that there are many potential paths into an adult life where a person can earn a living that can more or less pay the rent (maybe with a roommate or two) and leave a little something extra to save for a rainy day.
Hi Catherine, this is Chris. I wanted to offer a suggestion for your chemistry daughter. If she wants to go ahead in grad school, and is talented in organic chemistry, have her look into going on in grad school in food science. There are opportunities in that field. Our son was able to get a USDA fellowship for his masters and PhD. There is a shortage of folks with advanced degrees in this and other agriculture fields. Our government has fellowships to try to educate the next generation of college professors and research scientists. The schools have to apply for the fellowships, not necessarily the students. The fellowships pay the tuition, a living stipend and a grant for the research. Our son came out a PhD with no debt from one of the Midwest universities that has a food science major. I am not sure where your daughter goes to school, but hopefully a place where she could start making contacts. We had no idea these fellowships existed, and I try to tell anyone who has kids talented in chemistry. Our son has a good job as a research scientist.
Thanks for this! I’ll share this idea. Though it’s hardly “food”, the joke in our house is that she’ll be working on the next flavor for Doritos.
Catherine, a very nice article. Not forcing or influencing kids to do what we think is good will not work. You did a fine job!
Honestly, it’s not easy to keep my opinions to myself at times. But it’s the 21st century and seemingly the rate of change is accelerating so plenty of room for youthful innovation. Thank you for your comment, I really appreciate it.
Thanks for so much food for thought and advice, Catherine, as I begin to navigate the college app process with my 11th grader grandson who lives with me. Best wishes to you and your kids.
Good luck with application season!
I’ve watched my kids’ friends’ journeys the past three years and am impressed with their starts and pivots, they seem to be working out okay. I keep telling my youngest that he has time to experiment and to expect things to occasionally go sideways. Not their fault that they are being asked to make life-shaping decisions when most feel they are hardly ready for it. I may be on pin and needles over it but try to present a calm front.
It sounds like the 3 kids each have a plan. Plans don’t have to be perfect, but everyone needs one. Your daughters are implementing their plan and your son has given his future serious thought. Your comments about him made me think of my wife. Smart but a bit of a wild child, she dropped out of high school, employed an alternative fact about her age to get a job, eventuality got her GED, became a medical assistant, enrolled in college and graduated with the highest GPA in her class, and had a very satisfying career as a business manager. For me the moral of the story is to keep moving forward until you get where you want to be.
Thanks for the positive story about your wife, well done on her part! “Keep moving forward” is great advice, easy to give and easy to remember.
Catherine, wonderful follow-up to your first article. Please pass along my complements to both of your daughters on their hard work and willingness to face each new decision head on. And tell them they’re blessed to have a mother who gives wise counsel and strong support.
Last year, I wrote about my daughter’s search for a proper college path. You were kind enough to comment with good advice. Her passion for words has not abated. She’s consuming a book along with breakfast right now, and last night read me the results of her Virgil translation. She gets a charge out teaching a short Latin segment in her opening assembly. She’s also a volunteer at the local public library.
She’s chosen to pursue business, though, accounting, with words to be a hobby.. Her mother and I are not pushing toward either direction, but we’re interested to see how the journey progresses.
Exciting to see her fit Virgil into everyday life, much useful wisdom in the ancients.
When I was her age studying Greek and Latin, I was amazed in my readings that many complaints about life then were the same many have today (loud neighbors, difficult bosses, barely adequate pay…) so Nirvana unlikely. Made me a bit of a realist.
So true. Our psyches have deep classical roots.
What a great reminder that it is okay to admit when something is not working and change your plans! “Stay the course” sounds noble, but I bet that phrase is at fault for a lot of student loans, unused degrees etc.
Agree. Yet, since HD is a retirement blog let’s differentiate staying the course with one’s well thought out retirement plan. It’s often right after investors give up on an asset class or strategy that it rebounds strongly. When Bogle admonished us to ‘stay the course’ it was and remains great advice for decades upon decades of investing.
Retirement is perhaps the main topic, but exclusive. Also, how can we ever retire if we do not choose a career and earn along the way!
Thank you for your comment on retirement vis-a-vis the decisions of the young. Key to deciding to “stay the course” as you suggest is reviewing whether one has a “well thought out retirement plan” whose assumptions remain valid. As hundreds of articles published on this blog attest, assumptions may at times be rightly challenged. And well thought out ideas might be wrong. Retirement plans can also be upended by unexpected changes, such as the sudden death of a spouse or losing one’s job in late middle age.
It’s true that investors can give up and sell at the wrong time; they also are known to hold assets until their value drops to zero (sometimes rapidly, sometimes slowly.) Brighter persons than I on this website have offered a dozen reasons why human beings act in these ways, and we try here on HD to help each other limit our errors thereby increasing our overall well being over the long haul, with persistence and a modicum of good luck.
As Jamie notes, unused degrees and difficult to manage student loans can haunt people, crimping their early options and sometimes extending into old age. There are times to cut one’s losses. Even if one has a well thought out college plan or a well thought out retirement plan.
I challenge your characterization of Humble Dollar as “a retirement blog”. It covers a broad range of topics and features the writing of younger contributors who are early in their working lives and investment plans, as well as older hands. (Some of these contributors also have their own personal blogs, but I would not categorize this site as a blog.) It’s true that active commenters and writers skew older, Jonathan probably has some ideas why. (I think maybe retirees just have more free time.)
This site also features content on financial and life matters ranging from buying a house to lists such as the one with 51 things *not to do” for financial well being at any age (#25 “Don’t instinctively hang on to losing stocks” seems apropos to the idea of *not* staying the course.)
Whenever I’m thinking about making a change in my spending or investing, I check what’s been written on Humble Dollar first, beginning at Guide’s Main Menu (“Start Here, Go Anywhere”) https://humbledollar.com/money-guide/main-menu/
This is a suggestion I would offer any person at any point in their lives interested in making the most of their humble dollars.
@Catherine Appreciate the thoughtful response. You are exactly correct that HD is not a blog but a website. Poor choice of words on my part. Indeed, there are many topics covered by HD writers. The diversity of life experiences, choices and paths keeps many of us coming back regularly. I do think there is an overwhelming focus on retirement as opposed to other short-term money endeavors but that may be my bias showing. In any event, your three children are fortunate to have such a sage parent supporting them. I shared your article with a friend whose child struggled somewhat during their first semester of college. Your openness provided comfort and reassurance the mystifying paths of life ought not terrify nor surprise us.
Thank you, Catherine. I have felt welcome here in spite of being about 20 years from retirement! I feel like the information I gain from reading HD helps make decisions now that will set me up for a more comfortable future.
Please write more articles, I love your insight and writing style!