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You list each piece of data you want, need and obtain from a spreadsheet and I’ll see if I can match it with my all online bank multi-account, single source consolidated investments approach. 😎
And yes I realize some people just enjoy spreadsheets.
No 🔻please it’s just a fun exercise.
RDQ, I think that you are happy where you are and don’t want to look at info to see if/and how much things might be different if you had done things differently. If true, then ignorance is bliss.
I will suggest just one thing which, if you had done differently, would have dramatically (probably) improved your current situation….
If instead of buying muni bond funds in your taxable account, you had bought a total stock fund, you would certainly have a lot more assets. AND, you would not be paying IRMAA. Muni bond interest must be added to your other income to calculate whether you have to pay IRMAA. And the unrealized gains in your taxable account which would exist in this scenario would come out at the capital gains rate when you needed the money.
You wanted a “secure” future income stream even though you didn’t need that money to cover your expenses. So, you accomplished the income stream, but at the time, I don’t think you realized the IRMAA effect. Of course, you also had to consider your state income taxes as well. Only a spreadsheet would have allowed you to put all these factors into consideration.
With muni bonds you avoid the risks of the stock market, but you have to pay the IRMAA piper…..
I was just reviewing the performance in my Fidelity accounts and noticed a question asking if I wanted to download to a spreadsheet. I’m devastated. 😎
Pssssst……..Don’t tell anyone, but banks will do it too!!
So a thread in which every single poster has given an example of a data point that RDQ couldn’t obtain from his statements alone yet not conceded defeat in the challenge yet?
I haven’t seen any list of items, but I will concede I can’t match projecting the future or the past.
Simply put, spreadsheets are really handy for quickly assembling and working with small datasets to better understand the past or present, and to model a range of future possibilities.
”All models are wrong, but some are useful.”
— George E.P. Box
Ok, you asked for it.
1) You have been quite generous with information about when you started SS benefits and what you did with them, I believe the net proceeds were invested in muni bond funds (Maybe Fidelity NJ Muni Bond Fund – FNJHX) and have grown to over $500k and provide $1,600 per month in income. What if you had invested all the proceeds in Fidelitys SP500 Index (FXAIX) instead? What would the value be now?
2) You have stated that you started your SS benefits at FRA. ?What if you had done a file and suspend at that time, and started collecting and investing the spousal benefit while deferring your larger benefit? Would you be ahead?
Is there a relationship to spreadsheets here?
What I did with SS wasn’t for growth but a reasonably secured future income stream.
In terms of future income if I had invested only the spousal benefit I would be behind.
All my above base pay compensation was invested as you suggest as was the 401k
If the SS had been invested in index funds from what we know with hindsight it would be more, but it could also be less.
There’s absolutely a relationship. Spreadsheets do more than just tabulate data and display it. The real power is the ability to model real world scenarios and generate results that provide insight into the scenario that was modeled.
I have modeled and analyzed the 2 scenarios I posed and looked at a variety of other scenarios. I’ll post the results some time. Spoiler alert, the file and suspend would be the winner if you were looking for monthly income at this point.
What will your investment portfolio be worth 1 January 2030? What is your confidence level on this? What are the implications for your future financial strategy?
What’s the maximum amount you can comfortably draw down now and gift to your family and what are the other scenarios and the after tax values delivered to them in those scenarios?
Spreadsheeters can probably answer this.
You get the point – spreadsheets are not all about passive ex post data tracking.
Your example is spot on. I have a spreadsheet that models my cash flows, RMD’s, planned gifts, and additional planned withdrawals that lets me model how best to achieve my financial goals while minimizing (over the long term) my IRMAA and tax implications. Roth conversions and marginal tax rates are part of the model as well. Modeling this and exploring different financial options has given me insights and makes me more effective in managing my financial assets. For example, the differences in the value of a Roth conversion rely not only on the marginal tax rate both at conversion and in the future, but also the assumed rate of return of the investments.
No idea, but isn’t a spreadsheet based on the assumptions you enter? No crystal ball included.
Any future financial projection is based on assumptions. It’s unavoidable. That’s no reason to bury your head and avoid looking forward. You just have to use your best judgment, experience, and knowledge. When you quote various methods to fix SS based on models, I’m sure they are chock full of assumptions. No way around it.
Sure but that doesn’t mean it has no value or can’t be best/worst case and be information no bank statement will give you.
I know this is a troll thread but clearly there are many many things your hated spreadsheets and budgeting and modelling can do that passively just looking at statements can’t do. So your challenge is pointless.
You didn’t respond to my challenge last week. Let’s see a hypothetical financial model for one of your kids?
I don’t hate spreadsheets or budgeting. I just think they have limited value in real life, take time and can stress people out unnecessarily, especially budgets.
whatever makes a person comfortable and for engineers or accountants, etc. I can see that can be spreadsheets and budgets.
I use my own designed spreadsheets for my personal benefit. But I can’t look at someone else’s and immediately know how to understand it.
Would I be correct in saying it’s a possibility that you never had to deal with spreadsheets in your career?
I agree completely with your first sentence, and enjoy looking at others’ spreadsheets to see if I can figure out what they’re doing.
No, actually I had to deal with them and budgets too, but I didn’t make them.
My idea of a budget was tell me the total I am limited to for the year and I won’t spend more, but I will decide how and on what to spend it.
Maybe that’s why I say take net income, save what you need to, don’t end the month with a credit card balance and spend the rest as you like. A budget!
If someone values using, even enjoys using a spreadsheet for personal finance, none of my business.
I think RDQ thinks he’s being clever pretending that spreadsheets are the domain of nerds.
But really it’s simply a basic numeracy lifeskill on a par with operating a calculator and no more something to be proud of than inability to read or write in English. form basic logical arguments or send an email.
Did I say that?
Well it clearly stresses you out given the lengths you’ll go to to avoid using some of the many great free tools available to model the future. (Really you WOULD learn a lot and have less repetitive/ entrenched opinions). Get one of your kids or grandkids to help you if you really want to give them a financial gift.
But I don’t think it’s as stressful for the ordinary person as relying on checking bank statements and investment statements every month to see if they are OK. Anyone with a decent plan should only need to check in once a year or so ( except for checks for fraud).
You are very much the exception with your exec comp package and your high rolling lifestyle. So I fear it rather devalues the worth of your opinion as to how others should manage their affairs.
What has my lifestyle to do with spreadsheets? I’ve never been referred to as high rolling. I hope Connie doesn’t read this. She won’t recognize me.
You’re happy paying 80k tuition for each of 11 grandkids on top of bankrolling 4 kids fully through private universities. Sounds pretty high rolling compared to most retirees.
You can’t see that your surplus capital and your inability to grasp the purpose and value of forward planning for everyone elseare somewhat related?
Where did you get that?
I’m not paying the grandchildren’s college. All we are doing is funding a modest amount each month in a 529 college fund. What each fund has accumulated since their birth won’t pay for half of one year’s cost.
As for our children we remortgaged our home twice, used all our investments at that point and made monthly payments for ten years and longer to pay off the mortgage.
You wrote
Unfortunately what we are able to fund for 11 will likely cover one year of college, but it’s something.
And earlier you’d referenced at least 2 grandkids in private liberal arts colleges with a 80k pa price tag.
I know you don’t like maths but by my simple reckoning that’s your own words saying you can fund 880k.
What I wrote was poorly worded I see. Likely should have been unlikely.
Many of them are years away from college at this point.
What we have accumulated so far for the ones in college will cover a bit more than 1/2 one year’s total cost for each.
Not sure where the other nine will end up, but we keep contributing.
I really don’t think so 🤔
No but I bet you can give me some reasonable best/worst case scenarios with some spreadsheet modelling – then use that as a basis on which to track how you are doing at a point in time.
I can for instance tell you when I think I might deplete my general investment account and then when I might deplete ISA (Roth IRA in US terms) before drawing significantly on SIPP (Taxable 401K in US terms). Or flip strategy to accelerate SIPP draw if I fear RMDs or recognise I need to get cash out up to a tax band.
I will concede that point
How about how much you’ve spent on utilities this year and a comparison with the same period last year? And the percentage increase.
Oh, by the way. My utilities are a fixed plan so I pay the same amount each month and it may change once a year.
I no longer pay utility bills, but Quicken has the data on spending from when I did. Presumably I could calculate the percentage if I cared.
I don’t know either….was just giving Mr Quinn a challenge
I was responding to the challenge – I don’t use spreadsheets either.
What we spent is all on my bank site and by month since the payments are taken from one account. If I worked a bit I could answer the last two questions, but why do I care?
Besides those utility bills pay my pension😁
😂
Maybe just the % increase since no numbers involved
FYI the utility bill is $157 a month for gas and electric. I looked up in my account for bill paying. 😇
You piqued my curiosity and I just had to have a look myself…. approximately 125 of your fine US dollars for me
No numbers, of course