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Perspicacious Perplexity

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AUTHOR: billehart on 7/04/2024

I wrote recently about my attempts to improve my asset location. Now, I’ve even consulted an AI chatbot, Perplexity, on the subject, and it produced a surprisingly good answer—it even knew I was asking about taxes when I forgot to use the word tax in my question.

As part of the plan I wrote about, I’m preparing to buy another stock ETF for my taxable account from the proceeds of a Treasury bill maturing soon. I will sell an identical amount of a stock holding in a Traditional IRA and place the proceeds in bonds. The net result would be lower taxes, as qualified dividends are taxed at the capital gains rate instead of the ordinary income rate. I would still have access to the bonds in an emergency, such as job loss, because I’m over 59 and a half.

But from that taxable account, I’ve been drawing interest, dividends and mutual fund capital gains yearly to max out my Roth IRA. (I also save to a Roth 4011(k) from my paychecks.)

I wanted to know if it mattered, tax-wise, whether I invested in a high-dividend stock ETF or an ETF with lower dividends, such as a total market index ETF or a growth-stock ETF. (For comparison purposes, you need to assume identical total returns for each investment, as Perplexity was artificially intelligent enough to point out.)

Psychologically, I seem happier diverting dividends to fund the Roth IRA. I’m loath to sell shares for that purpose, though in reality, it makes little difference. It’s just one of my psychological tics.

Without further ado, below is the question I posed Perplexity, and its verbatim answer. (Note: I got a completely wrong answer from a different chatbot.)

You won’t be able to see here the sources of Perplexity’s answer, though they are helpfully footnoted by the chatbot. They include Investopedia, the r/dividends sub on Reddit and a site called SmartAsset, which describes itself as a service to link consumers to financial advisors.

What do you think of Perplexity’s answer, and the topic in general? Are you ready to replace your financial advisor with AI?

“Mathematically, is there a difference between paying 15% on steady dividends versus paying 15% when you sell?”

“Mathematically, there is no significant difference between paying 15% tax on steady dividends versus paying 15% capital gains tax when you sell shares, assuming the same total return. However, there are some nuanced differences to consider:

  1. Timing of taxation: Dividends are typically taxed in the year they are received, while capital gains taxes are only incurred when you sell shares. This gives you more control over the timing of your tax liability with selling shares.
  2. Tax deferral: With a strategy of selling shares, you can potentially defer taxes longer, allowing your investments to grow tax-free for a more extended period
  3. Flexibility: Selling shares allows you to choose exactly how much income you need, whereas dividends are paid at set amounts and intervals determined by the company
  4. Reinvestment opportunities: When receiving dividends, you have the option to reinvest immediately, potentially compound your returns. However, this can also be achieved by not selling shares in a growth strategy.
  5. Impact on investment value: Dividend payments typically result in a corresponding decrease in share price, while selling shares directly reduces your ownership stake
  6. Long-term growth potential: Companies that reinvest profits instead of paying dividends may have higher growth potential, which could lead to greater long-term returns

While the 15% tax rate may be the same in both scenarios, the overall impact on your investment strategy and long-term returns can differ. The choice between dividend investing and a total return approach often depends on individual financial goals, tax situation, and risk tolerance.”

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Bill W.
6 months ago

Well now, which is better paying taxes on qualified dividends or cap gains.  Married taxpayers don’t pay for TY2024. A big help to couples living on retirement incomes. For unbelievers, use your tax software with various incomes and see how much tax is levied (hint:  use a fake soc sec number and for heaven’s sake, don’t efile the fake return)

Randy Dobkin
6 months ago
Reply to  Bill W.

You can use TurboTax (downloaded version) and its What-if worksheet under forms view, although they haven’t updated the qualified dividends and capital gains brackets for 2024 yet.

Bill W.
6 months ago
Reply to  Bill W.

OMG, I left off the most important parts, there is no tax on qualified dividends or LT Cap gains with maximum taxable income (not AGI or MAGI).

Single 0-$47,025
Married filing Jointly 0-$94,054

Sorry for this.

R Quinn
6 months ago
Reply to  Bill W.

Up to certain income limits only.

Jonathan Clements
Admin
6 months ago
Reply to  Bill W.

Bill: Perhaps you could explain a little more. Yes, some taxpayers — both single and married — can qualify for a 0% capital-gains rate. Is that what you’re referring to here?

https://humbledollar.com/money-guide/income-vs-capital-gains/

Bill W.
6 months ago

Thank you Mr.C, your link goes into a lot of detail,a lot for mere mortals to digest. Whats nice about the tax treatment is mutual payouts annually can go tax free but the real help is when one takes a distribution, the taxable amount is quite low since the annual payouts were reported on previous returns.

Fred Miller
6 months ago

What about ETF/mutual funds that include non-qualified dividends? If the ETF/fund distributes 100% qualified dividends, then I agree that mathematically there “is no significant difference between paying 15% tax on steady dividends versus paying 15% capital gains tax when you sell shares, assuming the same total return”. However, three of four of my index funds in my taxable account distribute non-qualified dividends and thus I have to pay ordinary income tax on those. For example, one of my index funds distributes roughly $1,000 in dividends, 30% of those are non-qualified. Thus, I have to pay ordinary income tax rate on the $300 and capital gains rate on $700. If I just sold $1,000 worth of shares, all $1,000 would be taxed at the capital gains rate (assuming I held the shares more than 1 year). Thoughts?

Edmund Marsh
6 months ago

This is an interesting post, Bill. Thanks.

Jonathan Clements
Admin
6 months ago

It is indeed a surprisingly good answer — better than a lot of the answers I’ve received when playing around with the AI engines. In your situation, where you’re looking to use your taxable-account gains to fund your Roth, it shouldn’t make any tax difference whether you’re investing for dividends or price appreciation. In either case, presumably you’re aiming to carve off a similar amount of dividends plus capital gains each year to fund your Roth, and both will likely be taxed at 15%.

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